Highwoods walks away from Shockoe Center, Boulevard proposals
The RTD is reporting that the Shockoe Center proposal is dead:
Developers of the proposed Shockoe Center ballpark announced this afternoon that they’re walking away from the project as well as a proposal for development along the Boulevard.
Citizens Against Virtually Everything prevail again! Well done, Richmond.
I look forward to moving to Alexandria.
Well, it hadn’t exactly generated the excitement they had hoped. Do we know what is the state of the baseball team? Is baseball still coming?
I was kind of looking forward to it. Hopefully that parking lot won’t just sit empty for the next 20 years now.
Daniel, baseball team isn’t coming, at least not the one in Connecticut they (isn’t the group called Richmond Sportsbackers?) were trying to buy, turned out the so-called investors didn’t have the money to buy the team.
let them go beg for some other areas tax revenue
@Liberty – how much tax revenue is that venue currently generating? ;-)
Statement by the Shockoe Center and Boulevard Development Teams via nbc12′s Decision Virginia:
This is a terrible loss for Shockoe Bottom. $300 million in investment which would have helped add vitality and livability to an already wonderful neighborhood. The city and community really blew it on this one. Next time your wonder why your public schools don’t have more money to provide a solid education, remember that the community and city preferred a parking lot to substantial private investment which (eventually) would have led to significant tax revenue increases in the area, both by this investment in particular and by the other development it would have spurred.
This means losing more than just a stadium. This would have been a great opportunity to put businesses, shops, and a maybe even a real grocery store downtown. What a bummer.
Opposition to the development is not what killed the project, it was the flaws in the project itself that caused it to fail. So it turns out that they were dependent on public money to make it happen, contrary to what the supporters were saying, and which would have left Richmonders with the debt if it failed. Richmonders aren’t opposed to development, they’re opposed to getting ripped off. I say start from scratch and find something to put there that would actually benefit the city.
Thank you Ramzi for putting it so well.
Opposition could not have killed it, there was never any public input, other than a lot of comments on blogs and comments in the Times Dispatch, and the developers trying to sell the idea in a bunch of meetings. They just figured out it wouldn’t work in this economy and the second Davenport study reiterated that the city would have to be on the hook for the bonds.
When they first proposed the TIF financing, I emailed a friend who lives in another state and has thirty years of stockbrokerage / financial planning expertise, and he said TIF financing, in his experience, rarely works, generally the locality ends up being stuck. He mentioned things like the failed project in D.C. that was done with TIF financing, as well as other places. I think we’re much better off without these developers; let someone else step up with a viable plan.
Also, wasn’t it something called Opening Day Partners, or something like that, who recently proposed renovating the Diamond for baseball, at a somewhat reasonable cost? Like 18 million or something like that? And didn’t Chesterfield and Henrico say they were at least looking at that, which would not put the city on the hook for so much money? That would at least satisfy these hordes of baseball fans who seem to want baseball so much.
I’m a huge proponent of the high speed rail initiative. If / when that becomes a reality, DC will become a half hour to 45 minute train ride away and, in theory, a person could live in Richmond and work in DC. That would ROCK! And would be awesome for Richmond.
However, I am bummed about the failed effort to get a ballpark in the Bottom. Even if the bonds were part of the issue, I’m sure the (typical) community grumbling / opposition didn’t do much to encourage developers to make this investment in our neighborhood.
I knew I should have stayed in Alexandria, least they live up the the “city” part.
Help select Richmond’s new advertising slogan!
http://lifeinthe804.blogspot.com/2009/06/help-select-richmonds-new-advertising.html
It’s not just about baseball though – it’s about a conjuring a vibrant, diverse, and cosmopolitan downtown Richmond….
This is a setback…
I,for one, am glad this failed. As a city resident, I have just seen my neighbor go into foreclosure so my condo fee will increase now, City Hall has yet to process my real estate tax and don’t look now – a stormwater assessment where even at 0 living units per 1,400 square feet, you still owe a minimum of $ 25 dollars! The city doesn’t need anymore of my money right now for baseball – if you want it so bad, you fk’n pay for it!
The only sad part of this story is that the citizens of RIchmond will never know what a huge bullet they dodged on this proposal. The new stormwater assessment certainly gives a hint at the creative kinds of fund raising the city is capable of. I suspect we would have seen a lot more of these “special” programs if this stupid stadium project had been plopped down in the Bottom.
Now can we please return to the Boulevard, fix up the Diamond, and get on with baseball?
While I am somewhat disappointed at the project’s dissolution, I am still encouraged by the prospect of high speed rail in conjunction with the transfer center. If that goes through, there will be so much demand for something to happen with that property that we may inevitably end up getting something similar to what Highwoods proposed (minus a baseball stadium) while also commemorating the history of that area. We need to rally behind those two projects, which, by the way, have bipartisan support (both Eric Cantor and Bobby Scott recently visited Main St. Train Station to show their support).
Magneto, the property CAN’T be developed without something like a ballpark due to the floodplain and green space requirements. More than likely you will be looking at broken-up parking lots down there for another 20 years.
The feds have already announced that high-speed rail will go through Staples Mill and will not connect to Main Street Station.
http://www.timesdispatch.com/rtd/business/transportation/article/RAIL04_20090603-223403/271778/
Shockoe Bottom is destined to remain a blighted, filthy eyesore for generations to come. Way to go, Richmond!
“the property CAN’T be developed without something like a ballpark due to the floodplain and green space requirements.”
Where is this written in “broken-up parking lot” stone?
Given your previous statements and what we now know about what would have been the public financing in the Shockeoe Center proposal, I question your credibility, Fanboy.
I am surprised there has not been more discussion of Paul Goldman’s idea- using mass transit/high sped rail and MCV’s proximity to create a world-class hospital/medical center in Shockoe Bottom.
But regardless…
Even with the Shockoe Center proposal “deadâ€, the baseball stadium debate is STILL distracting Richmond citizens from other, more important priorities and issues.
Citizens must demand more from leadership and media than just the continued slugfest.
http://www.vagreenparty.org/richblog/?p=379
FanGuy, as usual, you are wrong. The green space requirements are not difficult to fulfill, there’s plenty of acreage to put in a park, and as for the floodplain issue, build an elevated structure. You’re still following the party line on the issue even though the developers themselves have admitted the flaws in the project.
posted by Omelette
“Citizens Against Virtually Everything prevail again! Well done, Richmond.
I look forward to moving to Alexandria.”
Good luck and bring your wallet.
Consider “Nationals Park” in your new stomping grounds.
Local taxpayers promised pie in the sky, fleeced for 700 million dollars.
Only a year later, crowds down 27 percent and on any given day, half the seats are empty.
Case closed.
@mucks – Other sources are saying something different, that high speed rail will be in Shockoe http://www.richmondbizsense.com/tag/high-speed-rail/
Very disappointing, but not really surprising given the current economy. Though I agree that Richmond is not the most forward thinking community when it comes to land development, I think that the current economy and the difficult bond market are more at fault here than lack of political leadership or courage.
The beauty of Shockoe Center project was that it brought a diversity of much needed development to tens of acres of blighted, empty eyesore. The opponents of the stadium were always right that stadiums never pay for themselves. The stadium was only the entertainment anchor to a coordinated private/public investment strategy that would encourage the development of the much more important housing, offices and business venues that would bring life back to Shockoe Bottom. Sure the TIF would consume of the tax revenue generated by the development for a period of time, but the hundreds, if not thousands, of new residents, workers and tourists drawn to the bottom would have brought in substantially more revenue to the City than is currently being provided by the empty parking lots (which are probably destined to remain empty parking lots for the next 10 years).
Now that the Shockoe Center proposal is dead I hope the City won’t mistake support for creating an interesting, mixed-use neighborhood in a currently desolate wasteland with a demand to waste money fixing up a 40 year old, over-capacity, crumbling stadium that has not in 40 years encouraged any beneficial development in its vicinity (please don’t try to say that the development of Movieland or Strong Hill had anything to do with the Diamond). There are a million other things that the City needs to spend tax payer money on other than fiximg up the Diamond b/c I am pretty darn sure that the new development propsed by Opening Day Partners for the area adjacent to the stadium (bumper boats and a skate park – yep that’s it) is going to increase the City’s coffers by about zero dollars.
With the official collapse of the Shockoe Center proposal I will be curious to see if the proposed apartment/condos on Broad and 20th and 18th and Marshall proceed with any great haste.
My understanding is that the train will still go to Main Street station, but via Staples Mill and Ashland. There was a proposal for an eastern corridor that would have bypassed those two stations.
I agree with previous comments that high speed rail service in the bottom will be a game changer for the future of the bottom and Richmond in general.
The Diamond was completed circa 1985 and is not 40 years old. In its time, it won numerous design awards and was the premier AAA baseball stadium in the country.
It was held up as an example for all stadiums to follow. The newer stadiums leapfrogged over the Diamond in amenities and had soaring costs. I believe I read the Diamond cost less than $15 million to build. Compare that to today’s stadium.
Any building requires maintenance. The Diamond saw very little and even fewer upgrades
I echo #20- destined to remain a blighted, filthy eyesore.
I think a great opportunity- note, the only one being offered- has been missed here.
Ramzi, what other development provides for greenspace, an elevated structure, AND provides accessiblity for the required emergency access as the baseball concourse did?
I will believe you if you can come with a major proposal that meets those requirements. No one has yet.
“Sure the TIF would consume of the tax revenue generated by the development for a period of time,…”
I am tired of hearing this fantasy b.s.
We are already paying for this sort of thinking with the Convention Center and the Broad Street C.D.A.
“but the hundreds, if not thousands, of new residents, workers and tourists drawn to the bottom…”
And here is the second part of the scam. How long are Richmond residents going to be expected to underwrite these white elephants that never pay off? These developers overpromise and opverpromise again and again.
Let’s get back to dealing with our future- the schools and neighborhoods we live in. Let these bozos go to Six Flags and ride a coaster to nowhere.
The problem with a park on this location is that the current parking lots generate income of approximately $95,000 in annual tax revenue for the city. A public park would erase this revenue and then require city resources for upkeep. Of course, considering the lack of attention and maintenance the city devotes to its current parks, maybe a park wouldn’t cost any additional money after all.
The problem with cultural tourism, i.e. a slave museum, is that no one is interested in funding them. http://online.wsj.com/article/SB124164783046593317.html
Bullwinkle in post 15 hits the nail square on the head:
“It’s not just about baseball though – it’s about a conjuring a vibrant, diverse, and cosmopolitan downtown Richmond….
This is a setback…”
I repeat:
I am surprised there has not been more discussion of Paul Goldman’s idea- using mass transit/high sped rail and MCV’s proximity to create a world-class hospital/medical center in Shockoe Bottom.
Hummmm, I wonder how many of the supporters of this project who are so hot to spend millions of taxpayer dollars have attended more than a handful of games at the Diamond where they had to pay for the ticket themselves?
I’m happy this failed.
I’m no traditionalist and certainly want to live in a more progressive Richmond, but some people seem to have bought into a developers lie, and actually believe that the future of downtown RVA was reliant upon a now defunct plan.
I’ve got a great idea. Let’s invest in THE COMMUNITY! Imagine that! independent businesses receiving aid instead of another large scale investment debacle. What the hell is wrong with you people? You honestly believe that pouring money into a parking lot would work? For once, can we please pull our heads out of the ass of Big Money and invest in the amazing resources that struggle daily to maintain their existence?
And to all of you singing the praises of Alexandria, GET THE HELL OUT OF RICHMOND.
Go and stop complaining. If you want to live in a soulless pit of stress and distraction without any culture or community to speak of, PLEASE, move to NoVa, and let the rest of us build something real, something human. It is the most potent reaffirmation of my opposition to the shockoe ballpark when it’s supporters complain that we’ll never be like Alexandria. Go live in your bubble of sterility, buy your art from Ikea and eat at Mikes American Grill. We’ll be just fine, don’t worry about us.
tvnewsbadge,
Sort of like the $50 million we spent on the train station that no one rides?
I think it is the same people.
posted by sprestonduncan
“It is the most potent reaffirmation of my opposition to the shockoe ballpark when it’s supporters complain that we’ll never be like Alexandria. â€
I don’t have a dog in this hunt, but I have a number of friends in Old Town Alexandria and I think it’s safe to say that Old Town Alexandria would not be the charming place it is today if the citizens had not opened their wallets to build that posh Triple A ballpark down by the Federal Court.
Yessir, the crack of the bat made Old Town what it is today, no question about that.
Someone up there mentioned that baseball would not be coming because the bid to buy the team failed. This is not accurate.
The EL president has made numerous proclamations that an EL team would play in Richmond next season, regardless of whether or not one is purchased by Bostic. Another article in the RTD said that the CURRENT owner of the Defenders was considering transferring the team to Richmond because the Norwich market is incapable of supporting a full season of minor league baseball (due to its limited population, cold weather, and regional competition).
Also, I agree with everyone who is upset that this plan to revitalize the Bottom failed. I also think that putting the counties on the line for the Diamond refurbishing is DUMB. This brings people away from the counties and generates tax dollars for the city. The only thing that would make this logical is if the city repaid the counties WITH INTEREST to essentially redistribute the taxes earned by the city until the counties’ money is repaid.
sprestonduncan, your response borders on inappropriate.
maybe it was the banner at Club Velvet that killed it?
Richmond is the ‘best kept secret on the east coast’ with rotten city government and antiquated visions.
posted by Anna
“This brings people away from the counties and generates tax dollars for the city.”
You’re talking about the so-called “ripple effect”.
Actually, when it comes to sports stadiums, there are a number of studies that say that’s a myth.
The real question here is, if a baseball stadium was the cash cow the supporters claim it would be, the counties would be falling all over themselves to build it in their back yards.
The reason they are not is because they know it would be a constant drain on the treasury and their citizens will not stand for it.
Why ?
I Was really looking forward to this.
I think a lot of folks are missing the point the developers made in their statement regarding the potential incompatibility of high speed rail and the proposed bus hub that would operate out of the train shed. Kudos to Michael Paul Williams for pointing this out several weekends ago in the RTD.
I think we can all agree that high speed rail at the Main Street Station opens the door for a wealth of economic opportunity, increase in real estate value, and increased opportunities for business and develpoment in the Shockoe Bottom area. What an opportunity for Richmond residents when it comes to job hunting!
How exciting to be able to live in Richmond and work in Washington DC and have a reasonable commute! What an incredible option for Richmond!
WITHOUT A DOUBT, high speed rail must be in close proximity to a city bus hub, so that all citizens of Richmond and surrounding areas benefit from the significant federal and state investment that will be required for high speed rail to become a reality.
Lets get our priorities straight here – no development in Shockoe Bottom should proceed if it is not entirely clear that it will be compatible with a major transporation hub at the Main Street Station.
So don’t get distracted by the failure of this one proposal. If high speed rail and a major bus hub come to Main Street Station, developers will be flocking to the Bottom providing us multiple opportunities to give feedback on how the current eyesore of a concrete expanse should best be utilized.
Excellent point Kristen. That is exactly why the City should not rush to spend a single dime on renovating the Diamond or rebuilding on the Boulevard. It would be a waste of money with little to no upside.
I’d rather see the City wait and see how these plans might ultimately be able to work together.
It’s amazing that people still don’t understand what a benefit the TIF financing program was to the City compared to every other proposal. Many fine things have been laid upon your table, Richmond. Stop taking a pass.
The Boulevard is still a mistake. Keep an eye out for other news…
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