31 Responses to “this is what nothing looks like”

1. posted by Jennifer C. at September 13, 2008 9:01 pm :
   

   It’s a parade! A parade of nothingness!

2. posted by zack at September 14, 2008 9:21 am :
   

   If you want to know everything the police know then apply and go to the academy! Otherwise, unless there’s a dead body on the street, nothing is a good answer.

3. posted by Broad Street at September 14, 2008 10:54 am :
   

   I saw this last night. Does anyone know what happened?

4. posted by concernedcitizen at September 14, 2008 11:29 am :
   

   zack said:

   “If you want to know everything the police know then apply and go to the academy! Otherwise, unless there’s a dead body on the street, nothing is a good answer.”

   That’s completely unacceptable. One of the duties of public servants (such as police) is to *keep the public informed*. Withholding information is really just an example of a power play. “I know, and you don’t, and I’m the one in power so I’m not going to tell you.” Believing that ignorance in any way makes you safer is just utter foolishness.

   Or, to paraphrase a statement from the IT world, “Security through obscurity is no security at all.”

5. posted by Dave at September 14, 2008 11:35 am :
   

   Or…you can just get a police scanner!!!

6. posted by john_m at September 14, 2008 3:33 pm :
   

   If you want to know everything the police know then apply and go to the academy! Otherwise, unless there’s a dead body on the street, nothing is a good answer.

   Why is that a good answer, though? It is our community and something apparently very dramatic had just occurred.

7. posted by zack at September 14, 2008 5:26 pm :
   

   Many things the police do need be not known to the public. This could have been something as simple as a hold up alarm or a drunk who left before the police got there. If the officer was on the way out when he said “nothing” and it was a bad hold up alarm, then it truly was nothing. How long did the officers stay? Was anyone arrested? Is there anything on the crime site? Since we do not know the answers to these questions, all we have is one person that said one officer said “nothing.” I think “someone” is taking the nothing answer out of context because they want our police to be the bad guy. John, I don’t like to argue with you but the only drama we have here are four police vehicles with lights on in the restored area. We still know nothing about what the call for service was for. Although the satire of my first post was missed I hope this point is not: while there may have been some call that generated this level of police response, the outcome was nothing.

8. posted by john_m at September 14, 2008 5:36 pm :
   

   I’m not trying to argue or in general trying to make the police out to be the bad guys. The essential question here is: do the citizens of the area have a right to know what the police are doing in the street?

   What you might be missing is that to regular folks, 4 police cars moving at high speed and then stopping with their lights on is rather dramatic wherever it happens. I was not the only one at the scene curious whatever was happening.

   Many things the police do need be not known to the public.

   Sure, I think we can all understand that. Where is the line drawn, though? This was a very dramatic, very public incident.

   Since we do not know the answers to these questions…

   We do not know the answers to these questions because the police officer at the scene would not answer the questions.

9. posted by Karen at September 14, 2008 6:41 pm :
   

   But maybe he couldn’t. Maybe something more along the lines of “I really can’t discuss it” may have been more to your liking however, the police are not obligated to us to tell us what they are doing while it is occurring. I, like you, want to know what is occurring in our community but I also respect our law enforcement officers and what they do…I don’t pretend to know their job therefore I try not to judge.

10. posted by kimmy at September 14, 2008 7:31 pm :
    

    I agree with John, “nothing” is not an acceptable answer. The police are public servants and do have a duty to protect and serve, if I’m not mistaken. Perhaps something along the lines of, “Police business,sir, I can’t discuss it,” would’ve been a better way to serve a curious or concerned citizen.

11. posted by Donna at September 14, 2008 9:00 pm :
    

    So everybody is in an uproar because the police didn’t respond in a politically correct manner? Come on people you are supposed to be grown up.

    Is it really any of your business what was going on or were you gawking hoping to catch a glimpse of someone else’s tradgey?

12. posted by john_m at September 14, 2008 9:23 pm :
    

    Donna,

    No one is in an uproar. Let’s not get have this get all prickly, please. No one is being attacked here.

    You’ve rephrased the question, and that works: “Is it really of our business what was going on?”

    To that, I say maybe, because I don’t know what was going on. If there was a domestic dispute or some other personal moment, I would’ve gladly backed off with that small description. If a robbery had taken place, I would like to have known more.

    One of the facets of this is that the cars & lights & everything were already very public and people were already very curious. “Nothing” was not a good answer because obviously *something* happened to put them all there. This curt answer was dismissive of my role as an active and informed citizen of the neighborhood. While there may have been an element of gawking for some people present, I don’t see how that precludes some minimum of a response.

13. posted by hillkid at September 14, 2008 9:37 pm :
    

    I agree with John and Kimmy. This situation should have been handled better.

    I appreciate everything that the RDP does for our community, but they are constantly asking us to be involved and “partner” with them on all sorts of issues. So it is reasonable for citizens, when they witness a ruckus like this, to want to know what’s going on, and for the cobs to give a reasonable answer.

    Rambo is for the movies, not for the police force. And it is clear to me that the officer involved was being macho.

    Why do men or women join the police force? Lots of reasons, but there is a faction that is Rambo-minded.

14. posted by LB at September 14, 2008 11:09 pm :
    

    Is there anything on the crime site. A white male was observed entering a paddywagon (paddyvan?) in cuffs and then the cops left.

15. posted by Andrew at September 15, 2008 1:11 am :
    

    It absolutely WAS our business and I would have expected a courteous and polite answer from someone on the scene once the situation was under control….and the police wonder why some of us have issues with them….

    Do I need to know names? Of course not. But certainly a general description of what the call was for. Four cop cars come roaring through a renovated area of Church Hill to one of our more quiet, relatively trouble free establishments and you say we have no right to know what’s going on? Are you serious?

    “Nothing” isn’t four cop cars on that quiet part of Broad and 28th. “Nothing” is an unruly drunk or kids smoking weed in the park, not four cars lined up in an intersection…..We have a right to know.

16. posted by concernedcitizen at September 15, 2008 7:17 am :
    

    Donna said:

    “So everybody is in an uproar because the police didn’t respond in a politically correct manner?”

    I don’t think you really know what “politically correct” means.

    The gist here is that the public has the right to know what’s going on in their environment. It has nothing whatsoever to do with “political correctness”.

17. posted by Donna at September 15, 2008 7:34 am :
    

    I do infact know what politcally correct means. The whole gist of this conversation is that people didn’t like the way the officer answered them.

    Why does anyone who is walking down the street need to know what was happening at that house? If your wife had been raped and you called the police do you really want the entire neighborhood to know what happened?

    After all according other contributors they deserve to know. I realize this is an extreme example however, arrest and crime reports are a matter of public record. If you really feel you need to know then take it upon yourself to research the information instead of having the officer feed into the rumor mill that runs rampant in our community.

18. posted by john m at September 15, 2008 8:02 am :
    

    The truth serves to dispel rumors.

19. posted by tiny at September 15, 2008 9:22 am :
    

    If four cop cars were in front of my house, where my children play on the sidewalk, I think I have a right to know if we are in any danger.

20. posted by Froot at September 15, 2008 10:45 am :
    

    They’re only required to tell the public what they feel like telling them. That’s why our city police crime log SUCKS. No details.

21. posted by Lady 230 at September 15, 2008 10:46 am :
    

    (comment deleted at the request of the person that made it. - john m)

22. posted by Eric S. Huffstutler at September 15, 2008 12:25 pm :
    

    Amen and a big 10-4 to that Lady 230.

    Eric

23. posted by Andrew at September 15, 2008 3:59 pm :
    

    Exactly Lady 230. WEll said.

    A simple explanation much like the one post #21 suggested would have gone a logn way in dispelling people’s fears and might have saved the RPD from a bunch of bad PR. Instead, an overly aggressive, macho, power play type decided to piss on the public…..

    Then again “Richmond” and “common sense” don’t always go hand in hand.

24. posted by Dave McCoy at September 15, 2008 4:14 pm :
    

    Hi gang, just want to clarify a couple of things. First, units were dispatched to a violent domestic call between a husband and wife at that location. Because it was a physical altercation units responded to what is known as code 1 (lights and sirens). Everything turned out to be ok. We have lots of these calls every week. Second, the comment made by the officer was ok in my book, if he/she were still attempting to render aid. With that said, if at anytime anyone is dissatisfied with a response from an officer, all you need to do is call dispatch and ask to speak with a supervisor in that area. It remedies alot of issues. Finally, keep up the great work on the Hill. Kudos to the Church Hill Reunion and the event at Shiloh Baptist on Venable. These events are what need to be in the media to show the many positive things going on every day in our city.
    Take care,

    Dave McCoy Interim Police Chief

25. posted by john_m at September 15, 2008 4:58 pm :
    

    Dave,

    Thanks for the response. I’m still a little unclear on whether or not I should expect to be able to get a response in a situation like this.

    The officers that I spoke to were not engaged in aiding anyone. There were officers there that were obviously busy, and so I did not approach them.

    If something is happening and we would like to know more, we can call dispatch and ask?

    If the officer on the scene is not engaged, should we expect them to provide something more than “Nothing”?

26. posted by G 2tha P at September 15, 2008 6:09 pm :
    

    Chief McCoy,
    How nice of you to read the community blog. Your willingness to read and then chime is one of the reasons (along with a reduced murder rate and a reduction in quality of life crimes) that I agree with Paul Goldman. They should tap you for the permanent slot of Police Chief. How many big city Police Chiefs would do such a thing as post an answer on a blog? Right now it looks like “nothing is happening” in the selection process. Good Luck to you in that endeavor.

27. posted by Jennifer C. at September 15, 2008 6:13 pm :
    

    For the commenter who used the example of a rape, that’s a medical call and therefore subject to HIPAA. HIPAA would also potentially cover a domestic violence call if there are injuries. In that case, you should get a “no comment” whether they’re busy or not. I’ve been doing this stuff in various places for twenty years - every now and then I’ve felt a twinge of the ‘tude with a nosy onlooker, but I don’t say, “Nothing,” mostly because it’s patently obvious that it’s not “nothing” to somebody. I usually just say, “Everything’s fine,” which has the same net effect but sounds less snotty (I hope). People call 911 for some really…interesting reasons.
    It’s really rare in Richmond to *just* get an ambulance or a fire truck or a police car, so you can’t guess what sort of call for service it is from who gets there first.

28. posted by Dave McCoy at September 15, 2008 6:48 pm :
    

    John, I spoke to A/Captain Jack King today and JJ Laino regarding the officer, they will handle things on that end.

    Thanks for the comments, one of the things I am trying to put in place is to have my media folks be very active within key blog threads, we have not done that in the past. Its a great way to discuss issues as you have demonstrated.

29. posted by Scott Burger at September 17, 2008 9:26 am :
    

    We have seen this lack of policecommunication problem elsewhere in the City also.

    Other cities, like Minneapolis, send out more detailed neighborhood specific email updates. Why not Richmond?

30. posted by Dave McCoy at September 18, 2008 9:33 pm :
    

    Scott, I encourage you to read the monthly newsletters put out by the Sector Lieutenants across the city.(There are 12 of them) They are very detailed in many categories, they discuss specific crimes, list who was arrrested for drugs and where they were arrested. Significant arrests, and other specific information of value to the residents and business owners of each sector. I will say that the amount of detail within those reports that are emailed are some of the best in the country. If you dont receive it, please contact your Precinct Commander and ask to receive it.

31. posted by Scott Burger at September 19, 2008 10:25 am :
    

    I do receive them but we also have seen where some serious crimes are not reported on them, while others are highlighted.

    We also only receive them once a month, while citizens, curious about police activity, are told to “Move along”.

    What the Minneapolis system offers is a way for instant email updates on a neighborhood level.

    If Richmond police are serious about community policing, this is the level they need to attain, not just “move along”.

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